Sorry, can’t find any better sources for this.
The animator then asked Maher what the “downside” of “getting a vaccine” was, which caused the comedian to go on an anti-vax tirade.
“The fact that you the fact that you don’t even have a clue what’s the cost of getting a vaccine that you don’t know the answer to that. You completely want to shut your eyes to the fact that there are repercussions to all medical interventions, including a vaccine, all vaccines,” he ranted. “They come, they say side effects, just like every medication does. You can see it in the literature. They can’t write it on their back on the vaccine. So you have to dig them. And of course, there is a vaccine court because so many people have been injured.”
Maher is one of those older guys who thinks they figured everything out 30 years ago and doesn’t need to try any more. The epitome of a lazy, entitled boomer.
The problem with Bill Maher has nothing to do with his age. He sucks, it’s true, but lots of guys exactly the same age as him do not suck.
lots of guys exactly the same age as him do not suck.
I get that but it’s absolutely connected to his age. He’s spent the last 30 years in a bubble of wealth and privilege and has never had any pressure to update his thinking.
This. He has no idea what it’s like to be an average person anymore so his commentary is disconnected and misses the point. The guy lives in an echo chamber… I honestly can’t believe he still has a show because I don’t know anyone that still watches.
What amusing is that he frequently accuses both the left and the right of existing in their own little bubbles. Self awareness isn’t his strong suit.
Wie all are vulnerable to misconception. I think many people are just not aware to this fact or too lazy to question their own thoughts regularly.
I still watch, despite agreeing with what is being said in this thread. I guess I do like that he takes controversial guests for example. Even if I don’t like or agree with that person or Bill, I’m interested to hear what’s being said. I don’t just mean his one-on-ones at the start either. He has some fun conversation table guests too.
Oh man, he had had Ted Cruz in early November. Cringe. But then the week after that he had Albert Brooks and Rob Reiner, which was super fun to see those goofballs.
He also had Andrew Cuomo and Melissa DeRosa on the show around Halloween. It was interesting actually. I had written him off. It seems that allegations were pursued against Andrew and they came up with pretty much nothing. Yeah he’s awkward and such, and I’m not sure I trust him, but Melissa DeRosa even wrote a memoir: _ What’s left unsaid: my life, at the center of power, politics, & crisis_ and she defends Cuomo in it. I mean, if he’s such a womanizer? Why is this person he worked closely with, fiercely defending him? She worked right next to him, and I’m inclined to believe she had a good view of this situation. I also thought Andrew was very helpful during COVID with his daily Covid reports. Lastly, again, I’m not some Cuomo thumper either, my point was simply, I am not sure I would have heard any of this if it hadn’t been on Bill’s show.
Sure he has some decent guests on from time to time but so do most talk show hosts that have been on the air for decades. What I’m saying is that Bill has become stagnant and they could find another talking head to bring in more viewers with a slightly less old white dude take. But all of that being said I’m glad it helped expand your perspective and view some situations differently.
It’s always easier to stay still as you get older. You have to start to fight to improve.
The struggle is real.
And the real is a struggle
So, you’re admitting it’s not about his age. It’s about his wealth.
If that’s what you’re saying I’m with you. Ageism is as wrong as any other bigotry.
it’s absolutely connected to his age.
I can’t be more clear on this.
And yet you live in society. curious.
I think they are saying the age is a byproduct of the number of years he’s spent in luxury. So age is connected, but by virtue of him having been wealthy long enough to forget what it was like before.
Your going to love Lemmy.
Exactly. His successes have fueled his ego into thinking all his opinions are important and correct. His failures are haters or people who “don’t get it.”
Well, TIL. For some reason, despite not really knowing anything about him, I had the impression that he’s a reasonable guy.
That’s been his whole shtick since the 90s. Ask “common sense” questions, elevate yourself into the Chad Wojack and everyone else is Soyjack, dunk on stupid religious people. Into the 2010s and 2020s, he went full culture war though.
I mean he’s said it in the podcast in so many words: “why are the regular people more right than the experts sometimes?” I’m paraphrasing of course, I don’t care to listen to it again but that’s what kickstarted this conversation.
Hey, we could have let the boomer remover do its thing, but no, you all had to go and get everyone vaccinated.
The epitome of a lazy, entitled boomer.
Right, because that kind of intellectual arrogance is definitely a generational trait that us Millennials and Zoomers don’t ever need to worry about.
So much generational bullshit that people buy into these days. What garbage.
Right, because that kind of intellectual arrogance is definitely a generational trait that us Millennials and Zoomers don’t ever need to worry about.
Your words, not mine,
So much generational bullshit that people buy into these days. What garbage.
In your rush to take offense, you missed my point completely. I’ll paraphrase:
Older people (omitting any triggering mention of boomers) can often struggle to keep their opinions and thinking relevant as they can become less receptive to new information.
It was true 100 years ago and it’ll be true 100 years from now.
Older people (omitting any triggering mention of boomers) can often struggle to keep their opinions and thinking relevant as they can become less receptive to new information.
It’s got nothing to do with age or receptivity to new information. Vaccines aren’t new. This isn’t an instance of an old person not understanding something that came about “past their time.” Furthermore, there are plenty of younger people who are on the anti-vax bandwagon, so I’m not sure what your obsession with age is.
I don’t think I’ve misunderstood you at all; I just think your opinion is wrong, bigoted, and ignorant.
It’s got nothing to do with age or receptivity to new information
Disagree.
Vaccines aren’t new.
mRNA ones are pretty new.
This isn’t an instance of an old person not understanding something that came about “past their time.”
How do you know?
Furthermore, there are plenty of younger people who are on the anti-vax bandwagon
Yes, Maher is like this on a whole raft of issues though.
I just think your opinion is wrong, bigoted, and ignorant.
OK.
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See? I can give pithy, easy, completely insubstantial responses that do nothing to further the dialogue and just make it clear I’m unwilling to devote the time to a serious discussion of the issue too. Isn’t this fun?
Not my intention. Anyway, you’ve contributed precisely nothing to this discussion so it’s probably best if we leave it there.
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except you’re not being pithy. you’re just an asshole.
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“Explain to me how the vaccine is bad.”
“OMG dude you’re so dumb for not knowing.”
“Okay… So just tell me what’s so bad about them?”
“Dude, just stop being stupid.”
“Do your own research” lol.
Facebook showed me something yesterday from New Jersey (I don’t know why, I don’t live there) where people were asking about a ship anchored offshore (it turned out it was salvaging a shipwreck). But the conversation naturally turned to the windmill farms that are planned for the coast there, and one woman was claiming they kill whales, which may or may not be true, but it was the first I heard of anything like that. Then she said, “Do your research and get informed.” I clicked on her profile out of curiosity. Sure enough, it contained rantings about mask mandates and God.
Oh and this is the first result when I google “Windmill whales”. Amazing what happens when someone actually does research.
one woman was claiming they kill whales
Ah yes, the famous “flying whales” of New Jersey that leap out of the water and get decapitated by the windmill blades.
Yeah I was amused by the imagery. They do know that the blades of windmills don’t go through the water, right?
I mean, a lot of them think the blades are producing the wind in the first place, so I wouldn’t have any confidence to say what their knowledge level actually is.
Maher constantly berates his guests like this, you’d almost think it was a skit it’s so bad.
It’s so annoying that this has been politicized into such an all or nothing situation. Vaccines work so well because of statistics. No vaccines aren’t 100% effective, vaccines aren’t 100% safe, they do have side effects. However, in the unbelievably vast majority of cases vaccines prevent or reduce the symptoms of a disease, lower the amount you transmit, and the most severe side effects are often still better than the worst of the disease. There is legitimately a population that cannot get vaccines for various reasons (egg allergies and immuno compromised people primarily) and it’s our responsibility to get vaccinated to help protect those people
As a stats major I’d like to blame math illiteracy, specifically people failing to understand orders of magnitude, but honestly even if you suck at math a simple pro/con list of each should still make it obvious. If the odds of cardio problems and death are equal with the vaccine and covid respectively (death from covid is 44 times more likely) then you should get the vaccine. If the odds of getting autism from the polio vaccine and ending up in an iron lung are the same (not even comparable because there’s no evidence vaccines cause autism) then you should get the vaccine
Also finally, rugged individualism is such an awful way of thinking. The whole “I’ve never had a serious illness, so my immune system is strong” is just stupid. You have no way to know what will and won’t kill you until you’re dead. Or in a coma. Or incapable of walking. Or on oxygen for the rest of your life. All of which are significantly more likely to happen from getting covid, which is almost a statistical certainty for everyone in the world at this point, that you should just get the vaccine
The whole “I’ve never had a serious illness, so my immune system is strong” is just stupid.
Yes it is. Plenty of viruses and bacteria don’t give a shit about your immune system. Never having a serious illness before won’t protect you from HIV if you are promiscuous and not smart about it.
Vaccines also faced a problem in that they are too good. I’m 48. I don’t remember any of my classmates getting measles or mumps. We did get chicken pox, though, because this was before the vaccine. My kids, meanwhile, haven’t gotten chicken pox because they got the vaccine.
Given that I haven’t experienced measles, mumps, whooping cough, etc first hand, it would be easy to dismiss their severity. “Measles are just some bumps on your body for a week. Whooping cough means you cough for a bit.” Completely untrue, but the Internet can spread these reduced severity descriptions far and wide.
If people experienced actual measles or whooping cough regularly, they would be racing to get the vaccines. By removing these diseases from everyday life, vaccines actually hurt themselves by making it easier for people to dismiss the diseases.
I don’t think this is a statistical issue.
When you boil down the rhetoric, what it comes down to is cognitive dissonance.
Anti-vaxers, and conservatives generally, have a negative physical reaction when they encounter a fact that goes contrary to their already established beliefs. Now to be fair, liberals do this too but not to the same extent.
There is a nugget of truth in their rhetoric which is that the government shouldn’t be trusted. On that basis, an entire lie and, quite frankly a political party, has established itself as “the government wants to track you with the vaccine!” while completely ignoring their cell phones.
Many of these people don’t want to know the truth because when presented with it, the truth will force them to either accept it or go back to what they know and, more importantly, feel.
This isn’t a battle over math.
It’s a battle over emotion and that’s why it’s so hard to win.
Yeah I was alluding to that. One would hope that death, permanent disability, and prolonged suffering would be stronger emotional motivators than minor heart problems, learning disabilities, and government overreach. But it appears that your preconceived notions can be so strong that you ignore the real possibile outcomes of your actions. I just wish so many people didn’t have to pay for their ignorance with their lives
I don’t think Math Illiteracy is the culprit in the case of well educated people, which I assume Maher is.
It is not hard to understand that vaccines have extremely low chance of serious side effects, while covid just has a low mortality chance, but a relatively high chance of long term effects. And these same vaccine deniers typically tout that covid is endemic now and “everyone is going to get it”, so we can just mark likelihood to get it as near 100%.
It’s not a hard concept. If you accept that you’re oing to get covid one way or another, your net chance of serious harm is much lower if you take the vaccine.
But to these asshats, it’s not about logic, it’s about ego. His phrasing was extremely demeaning, and offered zero evidence to his point of view. It was simply “if you don’t agree with me, you’re an idiot”. And that’s the argument I tend to get from the antivaxxers, and if pressed for actual stats, they will claim some conspiracy to hide the true numbers, and at best, quote all these irrelevant tangential stats that some misinformation article claims indicates the mainstream science willfully ignores in their agenda to promote dangerous vaccines.
Maher fought back, explaining he believes high-risk groups, such as the elderly and the obese should be vaccinated, but elite athletes such as tennis star Novak Djokovic and NFL quarterback Aaron Rodgers “didn’t need it.”
Uh, Bill you’re 67 years old. You are a part of the elderly. Now turn off Fox news, put down the remote and take a nap.
Nick Cordero was a Broadway performer and was in extremely good physical shape. Healthy, young, and fit. COVID still killed him. Being in good physical condition doesn’t inherently mean safety.
It’s remarkable to me how quickly we forgot the terror of the early days of COVID-19, before we had the vaccine and before we really knew what we were dealing with.
Yup, my shrink’s daughter in law was a marathon runner, mountain climber, etc. and now she can’t even walk to the mailbox without having to stop for a breather.
It’s been over a year since she was infected with only very minor improvements.
Fuck people like Bill.
I heard a clip of it. If I remember correctly, he said 90 years old. So in his mind, he doesn’t need it because he’s not THAT old.
I love the way that the cut-off for “incompetent elderly” magically seems to go up every time these schmucks hit a new decade.
It’s genuinely time for these people to sit the fuck down and accept that they’re outdated and shouldn’t be leading anyone anymore. Just check into a home and relax for the rest of your life. I’m sure he can have his ego convinced that he’s “earned it”.
Needs one of those dementia villages so he can pretend hes still relevant
Now taking bets on how old he’ll say you should be once he turns 90
As if he’ll make it to 90
To play devils advocate: He isn’t entirely wrong. There are inherent risks with vaccines, and they can and do cause harm to a small percentage of people.
Now to stop talking crazy: The harm caused is extremely rare, and the percentage of affected people is quite small. These risks aren’t unknown or hidden, and they usually come from allergies or a compromised immune system’s.
Right.
This is basically the same as saying that wearing a seatbelt is a terrible idea, because in rare cases it causes terrible damage to the wearer.
Let’s just ignore the hundreds of thousands of people it helps and cherry pick cases that look bad. It’s not like we’re a people who rely on rational thought to progress.
Which is extra ironic considering the parallels between anti-vax and early 1980s anti-seat belt protests.
I think the word you are looking for is apt or relevant, and not ironic.
That’s fair. I’ve probably never used it appropriately.
80s? To this day I hear boomers saying this exact shit.
Before I got any of my COVID vaccines, the nurse explained the risks, what to look for and gave me a pamphlet.
I’m not listening to Maher or MacFarlane about it because they don’t know what they are talking about.
MacFarlane seems to have read the brochure, at least. He wouldn’t be my go-to for health care advice, but he does appear to be reasonably well informed.
Its crazy to me as to how many people will use a “comedian” as one of their sources for healthcare information.
I mean if I wanted advice on how to be a shitty comedian then I would ask Maher for advice because he is a pro at that. But I ain’t taking his advice or even his opinion for my healthcare.
Its crazy to me as to how many people will use a “comedian” as one of their sources for healthcare information.
Comedians are consistently some of the loudest people in the room.
Even then, you can get people in white coats and stethoscopes to show up on TV shows and tell you medical-sounding things. I see them all the time in commercials and on daytime lifestyle shows. And they’re very popular bit-characters in reality tv productions.
But then that’s a big snag in the whole “Who do you trust?” game. Come out to Houston and talk to Dr. Steven Hotze. He will tell you all the same crazy shit Bill Maher is saying, and he’ll do it with an M.D. after his name. Even a strict “I only trust doctors” rule-of-thumb only gets you so far.
I mean if I wanted advice on how to be a shitty comedian then I would ask Maher for advice
Dude’s been a shitty comedian longer than I’ve been alive. Its genuinely amazing how long that guy has clung to the national spotlight, given how many vastly more talented comics have come and gone alongside him.
And most importantly, there’s a cost to getting the fucking thing the vaccine is for that outweighs the risks of the vaccine itself by an order of magnitude.
So yes, there’s 1 in a tens of thousands chance of serious adverse reactions. Which is a much smaller risk than the difference in adverse reactions to getting the disease when vaccinated vs unvaccinated.
Now to stop talking crazy: The harm caused is extremely rare, and the percentage of affected people is quite small.
True, and worth extending: for example, the cardiomyopathy (heart inflammation) known to affect some people (particularly, young men): if we’re evaluating the risks of taking a vaccine vs. not taking it, we also have to consider the risks of not taking the vaccine.
It turns out that incidence of cardiomyopathy in young men that didn’t receive the vaccine but were infected is higher than its incidence among young men that got the vaccine- and if anything, the immune reaction to the live virus (it causes the body to attack heart tissue) is stronger and more lethal than the reaction to the vaccine.
This means that the people arguing ‘but the vaccine has risks!’ as an argument against receiving it aren’t considering the risks associated with rejecting it. If you think about it, your odds of being exposed to the virus are basically 100% given enough time, and basically every adverse reaction to the vaccine will be milder than the same reaction to the live virus.
Yes- people are constantly worrying about the wrong things. Maybe they should be wary of lighting, because there are much greater chance of harm there than vaccine reaction (somewhere between 12-53 per million doses) and airline crashes (chance is .090 per million, or 1 in 11 million).
It’s also literally true that you risk choking to death every time you eat, but I wouldn’t advocate stopping.
You are absolutely right.
The hardest part about this is that, there is truth, to what he is saying it just needs way, way more context.
Pretty much ANYTHING has risks, including vaccines.
Brushing your teeth HAS risks, but that doesn’t mean that going natural, not brushing is the way to go.
Wait wtf risks am I taking brushing my teeth!?
It’s kinda like saying, “More then 3 Jews were killed during the Holocaust.”
Technically true, but still very disingenuous.
20 years ago Penn and Teller covered anti Vaxxers on an episode of Bullshit. They even provided an analogy for your comment by rolling bowling balls to represent the statistics.
They showed that there was either a really good chance of death, or a tiny chance of complications using the anti-vaxxers own information.
You can wear a seatbelt because most people will be in a car accident at some point in their lives or not wear a seatbelt because of the 0.0001% chance you end up in an accident where the seatbelt traps you and you die.
The way I see it is this: sure there are millions of reasons to hate drug companies. To be distrustful of them. But if my doctors say that something is the best course of action, of course I will do that. My doctor said that Covid vaccines are abundantly safe, as are flu vaccines. My doctor is great. I have great trust in her opinion. Therefore, I will get my Covid and flu vaccines as often as I need to.
I don’t know fuck all about the way these things work. But I do know I trust my doctor because she has been through all the education and has a decade plus of being a family health doctor. I trust her. And I think people should be more inclined to trust their doctors rather than random weirdos on the internet.
I don’t know fuck all about the way these things work. But I do know I trust my doctor because she has been through all the education and has a decade plus of being a family health doctor.
Tbh this is the same reasoning that medical providers utilize for their own healthcare. I specialize in orthopedics and rehabilitation…
Yes I know more than the average Joe, but med school was a long time ago, and you aren’t really proficient in a field you aren’t actively practicing.
When I want to know if a vaccine is safe and medically necessary I look to my esteemed colleagues from the department of infectious disease. I don’t really see how anyone with an MD behind their name can really attempt to fool themselves that they know more about a disease and how to treat it than the entirety of specialized departments.
If my buddies from infectious disease are taking a vaccine, I’m not going to second guess it. To me, it’s the equivalent of seeing a bomb tech sprinting away from a ied, and then deciding that there’s no rush because you’ve never seen a bomb go off before.
I absolutely agree, and yet for years we’ve been seeing unmasked infectious disease experts at infectious disease conferences that (surprise surprise!) become super-spreader events.
It would be funny if it weren’t so distopian.
(FWIW, I think most conferences for aerosol scientists have remained remote or respirator required)
I worked in a surgery center for the first few years of the pandemic. I’ve literally seen people who’s job is to wear a mask to prevent the spread of infection, wear masks that say they don’t do anything.
Sometimes you have to remind yourself that every class has a number of students at the bottom just making it through the requirements…
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Thats not how masks work. But Im guessing you believe your “common sense” is better than years of epidemiology research…
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Given a bucket of ping-pong balls, how many could you throw and hit a dartboard on the wall 10 feet away? Now put a chain-link fence in front of the board, say, about 5 feet. We all know that a ping-pong ball is easily small enough to fit through a chain-link fence. Now how many could you hit the dartboard with, through the fence? How many would get through at all?
Obviously, the fence would have no effect, right? You just have to think about the size of the balls for a few minutes, and apply some common sense.
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In their defense humans practically run off of cognitive dissonance, just cause ya know something on paper often doesnt mean ya know it in practice. On paper I know how to make an IED, but if im being honest id probably blow myself up if I tried.
But what about Dr. Chiropractor on Facebook that says that vaccines actually change your DNA?: “Through the RNA transcriptase of the aortic Golgi bodies?”. He’s a doctor. Those are big words. Plus, it involves me being victimized by a shadowy organization. It must be true!
Chiropractors are not doctors. They’re scam artists.
Cracking your back might make you relax your muscles and as a result feel less pain for a short time but medically, it’s of no more benefit than taking a hot bath.
My wife’s cousin was married to a woman (and he still brings her to family functions for some reason) who worked for her chiropractor father. She always calls him a doctor and it annoys the fuck out of me.
Well, you can get a doctorate in anything and still be referred to as doctor.
“This man is having a seizure! Is there a doctor on board?!”
“I’m a doctor of anthropology.”
“Good. You’ll be helpful after he’s dead and buried.”
Sure. My dad had a doctorate. He was a professor. Some students even called him Dr. [My last name]. But he would never have called himself a doctor. That’s different.
Paging Dr. Jacuzzi
Ah, good ol’ perpetuation of bullshit.
Just like in Western medicine, sure, there exists a handful of quack Chiro’s that give the profession a bad name. And many who have not evolved with the research.
Modern Chiro’s are not just focused on spinal manipulation. They incorporate a diverse set of techniques, including a lot of PT rehabilitation overlap.
However… Some of us do require that temporary relief that only an adjustment can provide. I myself joint disorders that lead to an uncomfortable increase of pressure that needs release. I can pretty much ‘pop’ nearly every bone in my body. I hate it, but that’s how my body is. They are all different. Chiro’s have a place, maybe they don’t work for you, but they are Doctors, and for many of us, they provide relief that others cannot.
Do not confuse MDs for Chiropractors or vice versa. Most chiros only go to graduate school for four years, and do not learn most of what MDs do. It’s part of the scam - they get to use “doctor” and people think that means medical professional.
They incorporate a diverse set of techniques
Lol, the one time I went to a chiropractor (because my boss agreed to pay for it while not agreeing to pay for me to see a real doctor) the “diverse set of techniques” included taking an x-ray of my back while I stood on a sloped chair and then telling me one leg was shorter than the other, and pointing a copper cone at my stomach and rubbing it so it squeaked and telling me he was “reading my internal vibrations”.
It’s the Vitamins of Medical Practices. There’s no proof it works, but if you feel like it does, you do you.
How the fuck do we still have quacks that are allowed to be called Dr. in this day and age? The Catholic fucking church is advocating for acceptance of gay marriage, is funding science, and is making other rational decisions, and our politicians and bureaucrats are like, “Well, let’s preserve bone
poopingpopping and expensive water in our medical system!”Edit: a word
The Catholic Church has always supported education, science, and the arts. They didn’t like Galileo because of the Inquisition (it was nuts), not because of any actual reasons. After that died down the celebrated him as a hero.
bone pooping and expensive water in our medical system!
Dafuq?
Chiropractic (bone popping) and Homeopathy are my guesses
I think he meant popping, then again given some of these folks into quakery its entirely possible at least one of them has shit out a bit of bone. They drink bleach for fucks sake.
How the fuck do we still have quacks that are allowed to be called Dr. in this day and age?
Well the answer to that is rather multifaceted, but a few significant patterns seem to emerge:
- Ambiguous use of “Doctor” as an academic title in general and “Doctor” for the title “Medicinae Doctor” specifically. This just confuses a lot of people.
- “Paper mill” universities, selling “degrees” for money basically.
- Adjacent to that, recognition of foreign degrees. It is worth noting here that this is largely a legitimate process which is just occasionally abused, specifically by paper mills.
- Semi-adjacent to that, variance in title laws by jurisdiction. What education is allowing whom to bear which protected title under which circumstances is very different from country to country.
- Regulatory capture, aka “I will create my own degree, with Blackjack and Hookers”. Several branches of medicine considered by many to be pseudo-scientific have managed to get themselves actual academic degrees recognised in several jurisdictions. For example the “Doctor of Chiropractic”, or D.C. for short, is a recognised and protected academic title in many countries.
Is there a solution to all this? Not really. I guess educating the general public on the significance of academic titles could help, better global alignment in title laws as well. Preventing pseudo-sciences, or whatever someone considers as such, from establishing their own branches of science and academic titles seem highly dangerous though. Just think what this would imply for gender studies in the current political climate for example. Pseudo-science is just the price science has to pay for freedom of research, and when it bore theology being a branch since its inception than it will survive the D.C. as well.
I agree, we should probably trust the doctors more than the crazies on Facebook or wherever they get their nonsense. But I think it’s also dangerous to place blind faith in doctors, who themselves are susceptible to misinformation and advertising. Oxycontin adverts appeared in NEJM, doctors went “wow I should prescribe that”, and that didn’t go well.
I think trusting Science is most important. Read peer reviewed articles and read them critically.
I feel like people gloss over clinical trials and how difficult it is to get from Drug Company has a drug to doctor prescribes it. Nothing is full proof, but the Process is quite involved, even the emergency use provision that was used during Covid.
You’re right, and an upvote for you. I’ve seen colleagues who encounter a 90% drop in efficacy when making the leap to Phase 1 trials (and this is excluding safety concerns!).
It is rigorous and thank everything the Process is put in place. But I specifically used Oxycontin as an example for a pertinent reason. Rigour isn’t applied to everyone equally, and I think that itself underscores a need to think critically.
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They did so plenty with the Trump administration. Fauci had to constantly correct what Trump said.
What?! You mean you actually trust the professional in their profession to be professional? The nerve! Do you actually trust pilots and believe they even know how to fly a plane?!
I used to think people who were skeptical of global warming would at least listen to the expert when it came to their health, but no. They’d let a politician operate on them out of belief.
Some of the issue in the US at least IMO is how the system turns patients into customers. People do have negative experiences with doctors for valid and invalid reasons, and if they can just pay for a “doctor” who does some BS pseudoscience, they see those credentials and they are getting much more “compassionate” care, they might even feel legitimately better after an experience like that. Doctors I think can become desensitized to patients sometimes or they just aren’t good at social skills. Like you have a potentially life threatening tumor removed and ask your doctor why you got it, and they just say “meh you’re just unlucky,” which is absolutely true, but it’s not at all sensitive to the patient’s experience to be that blunt. Go in to the happy naturopath office and it’s much different, “oh well lets look at your diet to assess your toxicity profile, we can come up with a plan and some steps etc etc.” I totally see why people go for that.
I try not to blame people for their choices within this system because despite all the pseudoscience bs that they’re paying for there’s often perfectly rational reasons behind it, and I fully accept the placebo effect as legitimate. The placebo effect isn’t just a trick that works on dumb people it’s a very real physiological thing. If people are primed by an incredibly compassionate doctor who practices naturopathy or homeopathy, and despite the financial incentive they have maybe actually cares about the patients, they will actually feel better and it will actually benefit them. That’s a huge complication for treating everyone who does this as simply stupid and misinformed, which they may be but that alone wouldn’t explain a lot of this.
So blaming stupid patients I don’t think helps and I believe the solution to healthcare and the mental health crisis (popular term for it) is ultimately political.
I would like to trust doctors more, however they often offer stuff like homeopathic treatments or over prescribe medications, where I am wondering if they are just payed to do so by the pharma industry.
IMO the financial incentives of doctors sort of run counter with offering the best treatment of patients, which then in turn destroys the trust in them.
Again capitalism ruins everything.
Doctors being paid to push a particular medication seems to be a mostly American issue and should be legislated against.
In most countries it’s illegal for drug companies to incentivise doctors to push a particular medication. Same as how in my country it’s illegal to advertise a prescription medication.
where I am wondering if they are just payed to do so by the pharma industry.
I believe the medical insurance companies, and what treatments they will approve/pay for, has a big factor in this.
The more mask off he goes the more I am shocked that even neolibs keep watching him.
It was during the pandemic that he started going off the rails. It was around that time that he started complaining about things being woke and I felt like this was coming. It was the initially smaller comments until I stopped watching as he kept focusing on how things were too woke and it just got super annoying. Not surprised. Others are saying this shit started earlier but I didn’t notice till like 2020/2021. Haven’t watched since then but guessing it’s gotten worse.
with mounting evidence of serious neurological interaction between the virus and the host, it is not surprising at all that a certain percentage of the population might get a low-symptom infection that rewires their brains just enough to let the crazy out.
It was after he was on Joe Rogan, he didn’t like that Rogan had built his weird man cave in a hangar and he was stuck on TV
He had Jordan Peterson and Ted Cruz on at the same time. That’s more than giving “fair time” to the right, that’s just a vomitfest of hatred and ignorance.
He used to willingly date Ann Coulter the epitome of vomitfest hatred and ignorance
Having her as a friend should have been a sign.
The idea is to use the media to push those neolibs further right. Just a sheep dog doing sheep dog things.
Neolibertarianism has more in common with Neoconservatisim than liberalism at this point
I would be curious to see the Venn Diagram overlap of those that still watch him and those that watch/listen to Joe Rogan. I bet it’s a circle.
Why do people still pay attention to this blowhard? He was a smarmy asshole even when I agreed with him. Now he’s leaning into right wing culture war shit to try to remain relevant.
Yeah he’s grasping at straws. People like him and Joe Rogan who chase views and plays at any cost are despicable and gross
I remember when I was first leaving religion and becoming an atheist, I saw a trailer for his Religulous “documentary.” I think it looked interesting. I was young and angry at religion. So I watched it. I still felt like it was bad. It was basically just him going around the world laughing at religious people. He made it seem like he was going to have actual conversations on the subject. He wasn’t. I’m surprised more people have been following him this whole time. Like you said, even when I agreed with him I didn’t like him.
It is titled a portmanteau of ridiculous and religious. You went in for a serious take?
I knew going in it was going to be biased. That’s not my issue. It’s just a lack of really much of anything from him. It just felt like him going around being an asshole. That’s it. Granted, it’s been a lot time since it came out, but by the end all I could think was that he was just a dick. Hence the fact that there’s also a lot of other people who agree with him on things that also still think he’s a dick. Because he approaches everything like a dick.
I’m not the person you’re replying to, but I had pretty much the same experience with the film. I wasn’t expecting a scholarly investigation obviously, but I was hoping it would at least be funny (it wasn’t) and not mean-spirited (it was).
I used to watch his show because it was live and guests seemed to have a little more freedom to say things than on other programs. I phased out of it around 2015 due to exhaustion of politics, but Maher has always been an asshole. I agree with him on Religion for the most part, but he’s mean about it a lot. His Anti-vax views are stupid because he’s worried about a small chance of a side effect and not a large chance of the main effect of getting the illness the vaccine stops.
he’s worried about a small chance of a side effect and not a large chance of the main effect of getting the illness the vaccine stops.
Poor risk assessment.
Fuck him. He’s sucked for a long time.
Seth MacFarlane is not an animator. He hasn’t animated anything since the 1990s. He’s a voice actor and producer.
And an actor. He’s the main star in the Orville, which he writes and produces.
He also produced the reboot of Cosmos with NDT.
Ugh, why’d they have to get NDT to do that anyway.
He just seeps with smug assholery.
Ugh, why’d they have to get NDT to do that anyway.
He just seeps with smug assholery.
Really lost respect for him over his Pluto stance and related book sales.
And a writer. He’s a writer for Orville, which he acts in and produces.
And a producer. He’s the producer for Orville, which he writes for and acts in.
And casts whoever he’s dating in a prominent role.
I can’t fault him too much, there’s worse things to do with all that power and money than to make your own version of your favorite TV show
I literally said he acts in, writes, and produces the Orville.
You might need some more coffee today ☕️ ☕️ ☕️
RIP. I LOVE the Orville.
Is he so fucking stupid that he thinks the NVICP was set up for COVID?
The NVICP was established as part of the 1986 National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act (Public Health Service Act, 1987; 100 Stat. 3756, codified as Title XXI of the Public Health Service Act at 42 USC 300aa-1 et seq. (Supp. V 1987)), but it did not become operational until the fall of 1988.
I bet I can count on two hands the number of COVID vaccine “injuries” that have been paid out from this fund.
Bill Maher is a moron, I don’t understand how he is still on the air.
EDIT: Correction, the Countermeasures Injury Compensation Program (CICP) was actually started in May 2023.
EDIT2: I found the relevant data for this:
CICP data for COVID-19 claims (as of December 1, 2023)
Total COVID-19 CICP claims filed: 12,700
Pending Review or In Review: 10,863 Decisions: 1,837 Claims found eligible for compensation: 38 Claims compensated: 10 Claims pending benefits determination: 27 Claims with no eligible reported expenses: 1 Denied: 1,799 Requested medical records not submitted: 337 Standard of proof not met and/or covered injury not sustained: 257 Missed filing deadline: 954 Not CICP covered product/not specified: 251This is an incredibly small percentage of the vaccinated population.
Oh, these are very interesting numbers.
Total COVID-19 CICP claims filed: 12,700
Out of about 700M doses administered? That’s 0.0018% of people who actually thought they had been harmed enough to actually file a complaint.
Decisions: 1,837
Claims found eligible for compensation: 38
And 2% of the people who thought they had something actually did.
That means that, of the 700 million doses of COVID vaccine that have been administered since 2020, 0.0000054% have resulted in an adverse reaction significant enough to merit financial compensation.
Thank you, Bill, for providing the information needed to prove your own point spurious.
Bill Maher is a moron, I don’t understand how he is still on the air.
There is a huge audience for reactionary bullshit. I’m embarrassed to admit that it took me too long to realize that’s what he sells, but when half of every show was whining about trans people it got super obvious.
That’s where I tuned out too. His outrage that a trans woman might be a better swimmer than a biological woman is way down the list of things I care about. Why does he get so worked up?
This wasn’t on his shitty HBO show, this was on his shitty podcast.
From your edit:
Missed filing deadline: 954
Apparently the vaccine seriously injured them, but not enough to actually bother filing a claim on time. Quite the injury.
“I got better.”
an actual decent take, backed up with actual information. upvote the parent, people!
Anti-vax is just another word for helplessly stupid
Maher isn’t funny at all, despite having a “comedy” show.
I’ve never found him particularly funny, but more importantly, and I say this as someone who did standup for a few years, he berates his audience when they don’t laugh at his jokes. I used to watch his show, and he told his audience, “fuck you,” when they didn’t laugh numerous times. That is something you absolutely do not do in comedy. Even insult comics don’t insult the audience for not laughing at their jokes.
If he was a jobbing stand up I’d totally agree but he’s got his audience who presumably are ok with him berating them every time an undercooked joke bombs.
He was still touring last I checked, although admittedly that was 4 or 5 years ago.
There are ways to insult an audience - Jeselnik does this well. Maher used to operate more in this fashion in the early-mid 00s. He really fell off during/after Obama though
Stewart Lee did it too, but I think it only works when the audience is ‘in’ on the joke – that is, they are expected to realise that the insult to the audience is itself a joke, rather than the comic actually meaning it.
And Maher definitely means it. It’s really obvious.
There are ways to insult an audience - Jeselnik does this well. Maher used to operate more in this fashion in the early-mid 00s. He really fell off during/after Obama though
His role is an establishment lap dog for two minutes hate
It’s unfortunate that some woman took a shit decades back and now we’re all still having to listen to the wet farts after.
The pair discussed the effectiveness of the vaccine, with the actor backing up the drug, while the Real Time host slammed the medical establishment in the U.S. for not promoting natural immunity.
“I would think this country did not allow for natural immunity to be considered. And I know this is a subject dear to your heart. Like, even if you had the disease, you still had to get a vaccine. That’s powerful stupid. They don’t do that in Europe,” Maher began.
MacFarlane fought back noting natural immunity had been debunked, as people repeatedly got the virus.
for not promoting natural immunity
You mean letting everyone get it and let the weak die, so only the strong survive?
Well, Bill would be out…
