you’re wrong. steam absolutely is DRM and works exactly as such. but it’s not mandatory, and there are games that opt to not use steam DRM. so there are many DRM-free games on Steam, more than a thousand at this point, but also many times more that can’t be launched without Steam.
There’s a HUGE difference between a platform having optional DRM and a platform being DRM. Also it’s not opt-out, it’s opt-in, so by default games don’t have it, if they do it’s because someone on the game studio decided to add it, Valve does not force it or even encourage it, they just have it available.
It’s very unfair to say “Steam is DRM”, and a more accurate description is what I used “Steam has optional DRM”.
no there isn’t. DRM games to DRM free game ratio is like 40:1. it doesn’t matter if it’s opt in. steam’s a DRM software. that’s what lead to it being so popular with developers and publishers in the first place. if they didn’t have it things would probably have gone a different way. it would probably have fewer games total than i currently have in my library.
If for every 41 games that had Denuevo one didn’t had DRM Denuevo wouldn’t be a DRM software. However Denuevo is a DRM software, a game cannot both have Denuevo and not have DRM, however a game can be on Steam and not have DRM, therefore Steam is not DRM.
Btw, I think the ratio is way off, the vast majority of games on steam are Indy which don’t usually integrate with DRM.
so there are many DRM-free games on Steam, more than a thousand at this point, but also many times more that can’t be launched without Steam.
Steam is pretty lenient with their offline mode tbh. What I don’t like is when I launch a game from Steam library and it prompts for login to some other launcher.
As a publisher, what is the data that Sony can get from forcing the PS account that they can’t get from Steam? I assume Steam provides all the relevant data to the publishers already?
as with almost every such case, they want you in their ecosystem. some benefits here and there, some in game extras, maybe some discounts, and you’re hopefully now invested in their service, which means you’re more likely to consider their games over others, since you might now consider the extra benefits you get from playing their games … stuff like that.
I’m not saying steam isn’t more costumer friendly than most other DRM; in just saying that claiming it isn’t one or that you can play any steam game without Steam is flat out wrong.
claiming […] you can play any steam game without Steam is flat out wrong.
You should go inform yourself, many games on steam can be played without steam. I’ve even shared my copy of a game with a bunch of friends and we all played together in LAN, with a single copy of a Steam game, and only I had steam installed since this was at work.
Steam does not enforce games to require steam, it is not a requirement, it’s available for those who want to use it.
Writing is hard, huh? According to the dictionary Any means “some, or even the smallest amount or number of”, therefore “you can play any steam game without steam” means “you can play even the smallest amount or number of steam games on steam”, or in other words “you can play one steam game without steam”. And like I said you can in fact play more than one steam games without steam, therefore you’re wrong.
oh my god. reading is hard. “you can play any game without Steam” means no matter which game. which is patently false. there are more DRM games on steam than DRM-free ones. so if you pick any game at random, the odds are against you.
“Any” has those two meanings, the fact that you chose an ambiguous phrasing is your fault, and the fact you haven’t apologized while making clear what you meant, but in fact doubled down in the aggressive tone tells a lot about you.
Also the phrase doesn’t mean what you think it does, you should have said"you can play all games on steam without steam", which would be correct, not all games can be played without seam, but some can, you yourself recognize this when you say that the odds are against me when picking a random game, therefore there is a chance. And this is the thing that seems hard to comprehend to everyone who claims steam is DRM, they that same phrasing with Denuevo or other actual DRM things and you’ll see why it’s bullshit.
In other words, a software is DRM if and only if every game that contains it is DRM protected. Let’s go back to logic school: if A then B is negated as A and not B, for example"If a dog then an animal" is true, so the negation would be false: “dog and not an animal” is in fact a contradiction. Or on the other side “if animal then dog” is false, so the negation animal and not a dog" must be possible, and indeed it is.
In this case what you’re stating is that steam is DRM which means “if it’s on steam then it’s DRM protected”, that statement is false because the negation"game on steam and no DRM" is possible. On the other hand “if it has Denuevo is DRM protected is true” and the negation “has Denuevo and is no DRM” is an impossibility.
the context makes it clear. i already said there are DRM free and DRM games on steam in comments you responded to. assuming i meant you can play not a single steam game without steam is just a dumb assumption because it disregards that i already acknowledge DRM-free games on steam.
you’re wrong. steam absolutely is DRM and works exactly as such. but it’s not mandatory, and there are games that opt to not use steam DRM. so there are many DRM-free games on Steam, more than a thousand at this point, but also many times more that can’t be launched without Steam.
There’s a HUGE difference between a platform having optional DRM and a platform being DRM. Also it’s not opt-out, it’s opt-in, so by default games don’t have it, if they do it’s because someone on the game studio decided to add it, Valve does not force it or even encourage it, they just have it available.
It’s very unfair to say “Steam is DRM”, and a more accurate description is what I used “Steam has optional DRM”.
no there isn’t. DRM games to DRM free game ratio is like 40:1. it doesn’t matter if it’s opt in. steam’s a DRM software. that’s what lead to it being so popular with developers and publishers in the first place. if they didn’t have it things would probably have gone a different way. it would probably have fewer games total than i currently have in my library.
If for every 41 games that had Denuevo one didn’t had DRM Denuevo wouldn’t be a DRM software. However Denuevo is a DRM software, a game cannot both have Denuevo and not have DRM, however a game can be on Steam and not have DRM, therefore Steam is not DRM.
Btw, I think the ratio is way off, the vast majority of games on steam are Indy which don’t usually integrate with DRM.
Steam is pretty lenient with their offline mode tbh. What I don’t like is when I launch a game from Steam library and it prompts for login to some other launcher.
As a publisher, what is the data that Sony can get from forcing the PS account that they can’t get from Steam? I assume Steam provides all the relevant data to the publishers already?
as with almost every such case, they want you in their ecosystem. some benefits here and there, some in game extras, maybe some discounts, and you’re hopefully now invested in their service, which means you’re more likely to consider their games over others, since you might now consider the extra benefits you get from playing their games … stuff like that.
I’m not saying steam isn’t more costumer friendly than most other DRM; in just saying that claiming it isn’t one or that you can play any steam game without Steam is flat out wrong.
You should go inform yourself, many games on steam can be played without steam. I’ve even shared my copy of a game with a bunch of friends and we all played together in LAN, with a single copy of a Steam game, and only I had steam installed since this was at work.
Steam does not enforce games to require steam, it is not a requirement, it’s available for those who want to use it.
reading is hard eh? guess what “any” means.
Writing is hard, huh? According to the dictionary Any means “some, or even the smallest amount or number of”, therefore “you can play any steam game without steam” means “you can play even the smallest amount or number of steam games on steam”, or in other words “you can play one steam game without steam”. And like I said you can in fact play more than one steam games without steam, therefore you’re wrong.
oh my god. reading is hard. “you can play any game without Steam” means no matter which game. which is patently false. there are more DRM games on steam than DRM-free ones. so if you pick any game at random, the odds are against you.
“Any” has those two meanings, the fact that you chose an ambiguous phrasing is your fault, and the fact you haven’t apologized while making clear what you meant, but in fact doubled down in the aggressive tone tells a lot about you.
Also the phrase doesn’t mean what you think it does, you should have said"you can play all games on steam without steam", which would be correct, not all games can be played without seam, but some can, you yourself recognize this when you say that the odds are against me when picking a random game, therefore there is a chance. And this is the thing that seems hard to comprehend to everyone who claims steam is DRM, they that same phrasing with Denuevo or other actual DRM things and you’ll see why it’s bullshit.
In other words, a software is DRM if and only if every game that contains it is DRM protected. Let’s go back to logic school:
if A then Bis negated asA and not B, for example"If a dog then an animal" is true, so the negation would be false: “dog and not an animal” is in fact a contradiction. Or on the other side “if animal then dog” is false, so the negation animal and not a dog" must be possible, and indeed it is.In this case what you’re stating is that steam is DRM which means “if it’s on steam then it’s DRM protected”, that statement is false because the negation"game on steam and no DRM" is possible. On the other hand “if it has Denuevo is DRM protected is true” and the negation “has Denuevo and is no DRM” is an impossibility.
the context makes it clear. i already said there are DRM free and DRM games on steam in comments you responded to. assuming i meant you can play not a single steam game without steam is just a dumb assumption because it disregards that i already acknowledge DRM-free games on steam.